From Trapeze School To Therapy Through Creativity

She got sent to trapeze school at three years old, and somehow that makes perfect sense once you meet Mari Riesberg. Mari is a creativity cultivator, licensed professional counselor, and the host of the Sustaining Creativity Podcast, and our conversation turns “being creative” from a vague idea into something you can actually use on a hard day.

We talk about what it’s like to grow up performing, what the “starving artist” life really looks like, and why it’s okay to want stability without giving up your creative identity. Mari shares how her path moved from theater and music into psychology through dance movement therapy, and why creativity still belongs in the room when we’re talking about mental health, stress relief, and self-trust. You’ll hear practical ideas you can try immediately, like color walks, tiny playful rituals with food or clothes, and borrowing a little structure from childhood play to make adult life feel lighter.

We also go there on the big stuff: turning 40 in the middle of chaos, feeling off the timeline society hands you, and navigating questions about relationships, fertility, and what you still want next. Mari explains how creativity can help you “get out of the mess” by shifting the lens from judgment to curiosity, treating setbacks like plot twists, and even gamifying the obstacles in front of you.

If you want creative self-care that feels real, grounded, and doable, hit play. Subscribe, share this with a friend who needs a reset, and leave a review so more listeners can find the show.

If you want to work with MARI REISBERG 

https://sustainingcreativity.buzzsprout.com

https://www.instagram.com/sustainingcreativity

https://www.tiktok.com/@sustainingcreativity

Transcript

Welcome And Guest Introduction

SPEAKER_00 0:01

You're listening to Diva Tonight with Carleen Humphrey, a relationship podcast with a focus on life, love, and friendship. Welcome to Diva Tonight.

Carlene 0:12

Hi, I'm Carleen, and this is Diva Tonight. I'm excited for our guest. She is multi-talented in many ways. Mari Riesberg is a creativity cultivator and a licensed professional counselor. She's also a podcaster, and I'm just amazed by all the things you've done. So how are you?

SPEAKER_02 0:38

Well, thank you for that introduction. I am I'm well. You're catching me at the end of my day. So I'm excited to talk about creativity and shake off the therapist hat for a bit. Dig into some fun.

Carlene 0:53

And yeah, I'm good. How are you? I am tired, but I'm good too. You know what I mean? How to say I'm like you. Like, and like it's the end of the day. I had a work day and then like get home and like try to decompress a little bit. But life is happening, right? And so how do we the one thing I I guess I want to start with is your your career as a kid starting off as in the so well, as how do I say

Sent To Trapeze School At Three

Carlene 1:20

this? Okay, so the creative side of you is started off at like three years old. So tell me about that. Because I think it's a very interesting story.

SPEAKER_02 1:29

Yeah, it's very non-traditional in the sense of the world. I was a rowdy three-year-old, and my mom was pregnant with my younger brother, and she wanted me out of the house. And we lived down the street from a trapeze school. So I got sent to trapeze school at the age of three, and that started my performing career. And I did my first professional show at three in a physical theater troop with trapeze and juggling and unicycles and clowns, and that was I never looked back. And that kind of became the world for me. Performing was my life for a very, very long time, and still now I get back on stage every once in a while when I feel the bug bite me that I want to sing and dance and act. And but yeah, I was a trapeze artist in kind of more aerial dance, so not necessarily Wringling Brothers circus flying trapeze, but more Cirque du Soleil style. The trapeze can be two feet off the floor, 20 feet off the floor. We weren't using a net, but it was yeah, it was an incredible way to start my performing life. And then that transitioned into more formal performing musical theater, acting and plays up into high school and college.

Carlene 2:46

Yeah. I think the one thing that people don't know is how much like that stuff costs. Like as a dancer, I danced and I lucked up that I got free dance lessons. We only I only had to pay the for the recital. So as a trapeze per like learning to trapeze, is that something that's anyone can do?

SPEAKER_02 3:06

This is a great question. I mean, we're talking the 80s, so things were a little cheaper back then. We didn't have we had different inflation, but you know, it was we're talking 1984, 1985. Oh my gosh, you're bringing me back. Woo! I like it. Yeah, so that's that's when I was three and four. And so that, you know, the cost of it, it it was definitely an expense, but I think living in Portland, Oregon, it it was a pretty supportive community. I don't know that it was a pay what you can, but it was definitely affordable because there were a lot of different families from different economic backgrounds participating in Trapeze school. So it was more of like, I want to say a little more grassroots, physical theater, Trapeze. We did a lot of I was in their children's performing troupe as well. And I remember doing a lot of performances on concrete in the sidewalk before the street, the street fair is over. You know, we there was a there was a lot of that as well as performing at the theater. So yeah.

Carlene 4:26

I don't know if your mom's still with you, but I I feel like do you do you think like her doing that has somehow like liberated you in a way? Like I mean, like when you have that kind of uh obviously there's a reason behind her sending you to you know trapeze school, but it's kind of like as as we look back, it's kind of the thing you see in a movie. I asked you two things at once, but let me just say this like in the movies, it's all about like I'm gonna run away to the circus and I'm gonna You know what I mean? It it's it's the the whole Hollywood idea, but like you you've turned it into a career for an extent of your life, so yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:06

I think I I think my parents saw my love of being the center of attention and decided to cultivate that or at least give me a an outlet for it. I was constantly putting on performances and shows at home, and they thought, well, let's let's channel this into something else so that other people can enjoy it as well. We don't need to be the only ones. And so I think that's part of kind of exploring that, but it was also like within walking distance from

Access To The Arts And Support

SPEAKER_02 5:40

the house that I grew up in. And so it was the most convenient thing to where we lived that one of them could walk me there and walk me home. And it wasn't that it didn't, you know, take a lot of extra time away from the things that they were doing in their life. And it gave me the opportunity to really, you know, practice and try things. And I it was such an incredible playground to learn how to run the world of theater from being on stage, backstage. I learned, you know, it was like being on a sports team, but just in the theater. You learn how to be a team member, how to listen, how to support other people, how to be in charge, how to design something, you know. So I was learning all of these skills, but just through this, this avenue that you're right is very unique and very much the story of the movies to run off to the circuits and and and I have friends who are in the circuits, and that was you know where I met them. And some of them went on to be, you know, in Ringling Brothers, or they went on to circus, like formal circus school in Australia or other parts of the world where they have formal circ formal circus schools. That is a tongue twister to say. So yeah, I like to say I was raised in the circus, but my own version of it.

Carlene 7:15

No, you know, I think the arts is amazing. I danced for 10 years. I did some jazz. Um that was a and ballet, like you know, and so I feel like I could have been a dancer, but I I didn't go down that path. I I don't know. I guess there's a part of my mind where it's like, oh, I don't want to be a starving artist. So do you feel like working in that industry for that uh period of time that you were kind of like, you know, a starving artist?

SPEAKER_02 7:42

I mean, it was childhood, so it was not like a career strong, quote unquote.

Carlene 7:49

Oh, so you didn't you stopped at what how old were you when you stopped doing it?

SPEAKER_02 7:53

Um performing with that particular troupe, I was 20 and then I went to college for acting, and then I sang with an Irish band in New York City and was a nanny, and then I decided I want to do something different, and that was when the world of psychology kind of came into my orbit. But the the starving artist trope or idea, I guess, big air quotes in this idea. No, no, no, no, no, yeah, yeah. Like, I mean, it's you know, a stereotype exists because it was true at some point. And I think now in today's world, we're trying to move away from that so that you don't you can be an artist and be financially stable. Like the the two don't have to go together anymore. And so I think there is still a large amount of being a like this understanding of you may not have the same stability that other people in different professions have because you might be traveling to different parts of the country, you might be living out of a suitcase for an extended period of time if you're on tour, or if you have a home base. And you know, in our 20s, this the world of subletting apartments in New York City was, you know, that's what you do. And having kind of a revolving door of daily jobs, whether you were serving, you know, waitress, bartending, assist personal assistants, that kind of stuff to pay the bills while you were auditioning or waiting for something else to come along, you have to have a comfort level with that. And I think not everyone does. The comfort level of I I'm happy to sublet from someone. I don't need a permanent place that is my own, and maybe I am living out of a suitcase and using someone else's furniture. I think you do have to have a comfort level of that, and not everyone has it, and I think that's okay also. And I realized I didn't have it. That was not something that was really ingrained in me. I liked having a little more stability, something that was my own that I could I could paint the walls if I wanted to, or I could do something different and and I wanted something a little more consistent. And so there was also this part of like, I liked other things. There were other things that really interested me. And I don't know

The Starving Artist Myth And Stability

SPEAKER_02 10:40

if you've ever seen Sister Act 2 with Whoopi Goldberg, and she says to Lauren Hill her little speech about wanting to be in the ice capades. But like, if you can think of doing if you wake up in the morning and all you want to do is act, then you're meant to be an actor. But if you want to do other things, that's okay too. It's allowed. You're allowed to dream big and do things and try something and have it not work. And and I had other dreams also. So that's where the world of psychology stepped in. But still in the world of creativity, because at my master's is in dance movement therapy. So I'm a dance movement therapist. That brings a whole different layer of psychology to it in the creative arts therapies. And so I knew I couldn't be like your traditional talk therapist. I needed to have a little creativity in it to make it, you know, meaningful and important to me. So that's kind of I did I answer your question?

Carlene 11:42

Not a starving artist.

SPEAKER_02 11:43

Yeah.

Carlene 11:44

I think I think you you summed it up in in various ways, you know. I I feel I see that creative side in you. It's just like, I mean, what you're saying, I understand because it's kind of like it is, it is kind of like being a starving artist. Like you have to find your way, like how to like dance, and like you might have to have a another job, or you might have to like subway. Like it just sounded to me like you were saying that in order to do that for the short period of time you did, you had to live with other people. And like that's hard too, you know what I mean? Like, we're not gonna go around that, but having roommates and and the things that come with being an artist, it's it's it's part of the experience. And like you're here today to tell about to talk about it, you know what I mean? And so I totally get that. I think hanging around other artists can be competitive too. As someone who dances other dancers, like you're competing, like it's a different, it's a different, it's a different industry. Like I I think what you did with um the people that you perform with might have been a different experience than had you become like a ballerina. You know what I mean? It's it's totally different in that sense. But but I I think it's important to bring the whole creative side to things because that's that's that's your I guess that's your knowledge and your education base, you know what I mean? And so what does it mean to you to be creative?

SPEAKER_02 13:04

Uh it's it's like breathing, it's fresh air, it's life force, it's the spark that keeps me going. Creativity is everything, and it living a creative life is the only way for me in terms of the creativity shows up in so many different facets of my life, whether it's getting dressed in the morning, how I put food on a plate, how I you walk around my neighborhood. How do you walk around your neighborhood? Sometimes I decide to go on a color walk. So I pick a color before I leave my house, and then I try and find as many items in that color on my walk. Or I'll do like a rainbow walk and take pictures of

Creativity As A Daily Life Practice

SPEAKER_02 13:50

all the red, yellow, orange, green, blue, indigo, violet pieces that I find on my walk. Sometimes I'll give myself like, I'm gonna go on a hundred-step walk and see where I end up. And so I count a hundred steps and notice where I am. I might take a picture of something, or I might say, like, oh, this is interesting. If it's, you know, if it's not sunny and it's raining, I might still go for a walk, but I'm gonna put on my rain boots and my raincoat. I'm gonna go jump in puddles and, you know, explore things in that way. In terms of like food, sometimes I get out my cookie cutters and like cut a slice of bread with a cookie cutter and toast it and just give myself the freedom to play with it. And sometimes it's opening the fridge and seeing, okay, what do I have? What do I feel like? What sounds good? And let me put that together. And maybe it's breakfast for dinner, maybe it's leftovers, maybe it's like popping something in the microwave, and all of it is allowed, none of it is bad, and you know, getting dressed in the morning, how do I want to feel? Do I wanna like do I have a secret? Do I put on something that's a little sexy and a little risque that no one is gonna see, but I know I have on. And how do I show up in my life wearing that? Or do I want to feel strong or comfortable or powerful or whatever it is? And is it an accessory? Do I wear a pair of glasses or earrings or a necklace or rings or a hat or a scarf or you know, tapping into the creative spark? So I feel like creativity to me informs every aspect of my life, and it means there is this untapped freedom that I get to explore each and every day.

SPEAKER_00 15:35

Diva tonight, glamour for your ears.

Carlene 15:38

Wow. I think I'm gonna go on a color walk. Mind you, I think I think like when you practice mindfulness, I remember going to like we went on a what do you call that walk? A my forgot the name of the walk, but a silent walk. And like you're seeing everyone who's in there, but you don't get to talk to them. And that for me is a chatty Kathy, is so hard. But like when you talk about colors, that's interesting. Because I think someone said to me, um, I was at I was at this um, I think it was a workshop, and they were like, if you notice certain things that are blue, and it was so different because the next day I started noticing everything that was blue that I hadn't noticed before. So for women in the 40s like myself and like you know, some of the listeners, how can you add creativity to your life to help you in like stressful situations? I guess, you know.

SPEAKER_02 16:31

Great, yeah, yes. I have a woman in my 40s as well. So you said

Creative Stress Relief In Your 40s

SPEAKER_02 16:40

you did. Yes, yeah. So, you know, this piece of like uh women in their 40s today are navigating so many different things. Some of us are, you know, have kids in their 20s, some of us have babies, some of us have no kids, some of us have careers, some of us are retiring early, you know. So I think no matter what stage of being a woman in your 40s that you're in, you can still incorporate creativity and it it just might look very different. And so oftentimes thinking back of like what are the things that really excited you in childhood play? You know, there's so many different types of play. Were you a a kid who lived in a fantasy world or created your own fantasy world? I was a kid who like lived outside, talked to all the plants, created stories. There were fairies and gnomes and elves and things that I talked to in the garden. But that wasn't oh yeah, that was like this magical world that I lived in. And I was always putting on a performance or telling a story. So this fantasy play was such a huge part of my childhood play. And now in my life today, I love listening to audiobooks, I love stories, I love reading, but I also love watching movies and I love, you know, being a part of the stories. And as a therapist, I listen to people's stories all day long. I love it. You know, that's how it shows up in my life today. But there's also like rough and tumble play. If you were someone who like really loved wrestling or you grew up with people, or you were really into sports, and that structure was the play, how does that get to show up in your life today? Do you sign up for a class? Do you play intramural sports in your 40s? Maybe it looks a little different, you know, maybe it's pickleball, or maybe you're taking up tango dancing because that's a version that works with your current body and not the maybe, you know, whatever sport you were playing. But there's also, I think, finding ways to spark creativity or spark joy in your life can also be by like taking yourself to an art gallery and just looking, being inspired by other things that people put out in the world, scrolling on Instagram or making a Pinterest board of places you want to visit, things you want to do. That can also be creative because then we get to find, we get to take that inspiration and turn it into our own version of it. But like have a picnic in bed. We all like to have bed days where we we don't get out of bed, turn it into a picnic, slay a picnic blanket on your bed, bring your food in, set it up, have a little creative moment just for you. I think oftentimes we, as women in our 40s, forget that we are important and deserve to take time for ourselves because there is a narrative in Western culture that we do a lot for other people. And so coming back to that, okay, what is what does this moment look like for me in terms of self-care? And self-care isn't necessarily a bubble bath. I mean, it can be, but it's refueling yourself so we get to show up again. It's the, you know, Audrey Lorde was that's where self-care comes from. Her writing that it was about kind of like refueling from a social justice perspective of being able to show back up. So if I'm not taking care of this being, I can't show back up for the the rest of the work that is important as well. So get creative in how you take care of yourself.

Carlene 20:42

Yeah, yeah. Wow. Mm-hmm. So you're in the 40s. So I mean, speaking of the 40s, what was that like for

Turning 40 During Pandemic Chaos

Carlene 20:50

you? Like, did you have some trials and tribute? Like, I mean, as you reflect now, you know? Yeah. I reflect a lot, you know.

SPEAKER_02 20:57

Yes, I well, I'm gonna be 45 in August. And so I turned 40, baby post-pandemic. So it was weird. It was bizarre. I have a summer birthday. My 40th birthday, where I live in Colorado, was like on fire. There were wildfires everywhere. The people were still social distancing. So my 40th birthday, like not great. It wasn't, it was a little rough. It was a little rough, but I, you know, realized that okay, I needed to make this something that was gonna be meaningful and special for me. So I went to a sunflower farm and picked a bunch of sunflowers because it's my favorite flower. And a friend met me and she took a bunch of pictures of me in sunflowers, and that was, you know, one piece of my four. 40th birthday. But turning 40, it was, you know, I thought I would be in a very different place in my life than I was. I was newly single. I was, you know, post-pandemic. We were, it was a weird time. And that, you know, I think I had thought by the time I was 40, I would be married, have kids. None of that, none of that was true. And so how that has kind of changed as I've entered middle 40s or headed there. Just, you know, I feel like there's a a surrender to it that I don't think I had in my 30s of like just being okay with where life is taking me. And that I don't have to try so hard to make it look a certain way or be a certain way, that it gets to just be me. And some days are better than others, for sure. Some days are easier. And but I think all of it for me is very welcome. That I, I mean, as a therapist, the good days, the bad days, the ugly days, the days that are really hard. Um, I welcome all of them because it it feels very human to me. Like I am a full human being living life. It doesn't just have good days. And I get to be okay with that.

Carlene 23:24

Some powerful words there. Yeah. I I can relate. I I don't know if I, Mari, if I wanted to have kids. I've always been like, I've said this to other people that I've always been a nonconformist. But I think I did want to be with someone like either married or not. But like you, I think, I think that's when you're like, when you're reflecting. Cause I I had my 40th, and like my friends were there and my sisters, and like I think when you have a group of people, it's nice to have that. But like you said, it makes you think about like, oh, I didn't, I didn't do the things that society expects me to do. And that that makes you realize you're like, okay, I'm gonna accept like where I'm at now and how things turned out and be happy with it. And I'm glad you you brought that up because I think a lot of my guests are like married or have kids and that stuff, but like to hear someone else relate, like I not to say I haven't had other people, but it's not been a lot. And so for you to say that makes me relate to you in that sense because it's like, yeah, you know, I didn't have kids. I'm and like

Fertility Shifts And Brain Health Studies

Carlene 24:30

I feel like I'm 42 and like now I'm thinking about it, and now I might be a little too late, and so we're kind of like, maybe I'll adopt or like whatever, whatever happens, right?

SPEAKER_02 24:41

You know, you know, uh, I think the thing that we don't, you know, women in our 40s we don't really talk about, and it's not talked about because but it just the world of fertility and how it changes as post-35. But like the number of women in their 40s who are getting pregnant and having babies has increased by 400%.

Carlene 25:03

Right, right, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 25:04

That number is astonishing to me. Yeah. I'm like, oh yeah, we get we can still do that, we get to do this. It might look a little different, but that's okay. But I think the idea that once you hit 40, it it's like you're too old, or and for some people they may feel that way, that they don't want to be 60 when their child is in graduating high school. Like I get that. I totally get that. And I think, you know, with all of the information we have out in the world today about health and wellness, and you know, they just a study just came out about hobbies and how the very creative hobbies and creativity actually changes the age of our brain. And the participating in the tango dancing, they actually proved that it reduces the age of your brain by seven and a half years. Like, that is wild to think we creativity can impact us. Like, we don't feel the same age as maybe our parents did at the same age. We don't feel the same at this age that our parents may have felt. And so we're living in a very different time right now to be able to say, yeah, I'm 42, I'm 44, I actually do want to have kids. And it's still possible.

Carlene 26:32

It is, yeah, yeah, it's it's definitely a different time, of course, for that. Yeah, definitely. I I don't know if I'm gonna go down that road, but I, you know what? I think I I think it's it's like you said, it's it's kind of like technology has changed things, medical and like just overall career-wise. I think like as women, we've changed like what we focus on. And so that's liberating. I think it's great when you see someone who I'm like, wow, 47, and she has like a two-year-old. Wow, you know what I mean? And yeah, you know what I mean? No, I think it's great. Like you said, like I I think at this point it's like you're more comfortable than maybe you were in your 30s, and maybe financially everything just comes together, right? And so that is very true, definitely. Yeah, you've opened a different side of the conversation there with that. So um, oh my gosh. So I mean, so as you know, you're a little bit older than, but would you have? I mean, should I even ask that question? That's a very personal question to ask.

SPEAKER_02 27:35

It is a personal question, and my answer is absolutely absolutely, absolutely. Okay.

Carlene 27:40

Oh, you're a free spirit, you're a free bird just like me.

SPEAKER_02 27:43

I'm like, now it's that surrendering to life. Like, uh, yeah, it's that piece of like if it's meant to be at this time, perfect, great.

Carlene 27:52

Mm-hmm. Did you find your person?

SPEAKER_02 27:54

I mean you're talking about oh, because I saw you've been there, right? Yeah, yeah. It's you know, it's you and I have been together almost four years. No. So it was shortly after turning four I met.

Carlene 28:08

After everything just like blew up. Like, I mean, when you talk and like fires and oh my gosh, I was like, I thought cold, I thought my pandemic was bad. Like, you know what I mean? It was like, um, how old was I? I think I was like 36. And so COVID definitely made us. Yeah. Oh yeah. Oh, totally. Oh yeah. But I'm happy though for you. The one thing I didn't ask you is like, you know, about your parents, like what kind of work did they do? How do they influence who you are today? You know?

Parents, Reinvention, And Career Freedom

SPEAKER_02 28:40

Yeah. So, well, when I was born, my mother was a massage therapist and my father was a drummer in a country western band. And so as a child of the 80s, I grew up in the bars with my dad.

Carlene 28:58

Um said that, like the whole child of the 80s. I'm just like, are we okay, anyways, go on.

SPEAKER_02 29:04

Yeah, it was you had a baby in a bar. Yes, that's that's what happened. Um and then my dad went back to school and he became a music teacher, and my mom was a stay-at-home mom. And then she worked at the school where my brother and I went, and so she, you know, worked while we were in school and then was home with us. And then let's see, later on, my parents did get divorced, and then my mom and stepdad bought and ran a restaurant for years, and my dad, he actually went to grad school for therapy at the same time I did. So he is now a therapist as well. So very different journeys. But, you know, this I think some of my like freedom in choice of career and was very influenced by their willingness to try new things and say, oh, yeah, this is what I want to do now. And at some point it might be different, and that's allowed and that's okay. And I'm gonna go back to school, or I'm gonna try something else, or I'm gonna start my own business, or you know. So I think that's that was where some of the freedom of choice in terms of career of like, yeah, I went to acting school and I was a nanny and I worked in restaurants, and then I decided I want to do something different, and that was supported. So I know that isn't everyone's story, but that was that was that was mine.

Carlene 30:34

Yeah, you know what? I think I think uh the whole thing about like, you know, your parents let it allowing you to have that free but freedom is good too. And and then I had the parents that were like, you should be a lawyer, you should be this. And then, you know, after a while, I'm like, I don't really want to do any of those things that are considered practic. Like, I guess I understand why they said that, but I guess I was always a rebel anyways. Like, I'm just like, I went to school for English, and then I went to school for radar broadcasting, and so many things, right? And so I get we were I I get I understand you, yeah. The total like, but I did it in the I did it in the total opposite. I'm like, I'm gonna do it anyways, even though you I love that too.

SPEAKER_02 31:20

I mean, when I lived in New York, I started a organization business where I help people like organize their homes and because I like being busy,

Running A Practice And A Podcast

SPEAKER_02 31:30

I like having lots of things to do. And so even now I have a private practice, I host a podcast, I'm a creativity coach, I do presentations for universities and all sorts of things, and I love I love all of it. Yeah. How do you do it all? Wow. I mean, it's not happening every week. All of the all of those things, you know?

Carlene 31:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 31:54

The university presentations and my sustaining creativity work. You know, that isn't the my main gig. So that happens. I can easily put it where I have space and time. But yeah. I love it. And the pot I love podcasting. I've been doing it for six years, and it's so much fun. My sustaining creativity podcast is amazing. I love it. I love talking to people and I love getting to talk. I love being on other people's podcasts like this, and ask all these fun questions and yeah.

Carlene 32:31

And your creative juices are just flowing. So we're gonna we're gonna ask a final question. I think this is a good question to ask. Ooh, just happen there. How can creativity help me get out of this mess? I thought that was a very interesting question.

SPEAKER_02 32:46

Questions that how can creativity help me get out of this mess?

Carlene 32:50

If I'm in a mess right now, like mentally, physically, like you know?

SPEAKER_02 32:55

Yeah. You know, I think creativity is a tool, just like anything else. So how we look at a situation, how we show up for ourselves, if the mess we're facing is internal versus external, what how do I get to look at this creatively? What's the story I'm creating about this internal mess? Am I judging myself for it or am I accepting it and saying, cool, plot twist, what's next? But how we look at it, how we the lens that we look at at something through can be very impactful. And so when we allow ourselves to look at something through the lens of creativity, I think it offers the opportunity to see something unexpected, to be surprised, to be curious, to wonder, to find awe in the mess, which is different than needing to fix it or needing to solve it or change it. Some of it is like, how do I get to be with it and be curious about it or be surprised by it, or allow it to change, allow it to shift and surprise me again? And if it's an

Using Creativity To Get Unstuck

SPEAKER_02 34:10

external mess, how do I get to like maybe I look at it through the lens of Mary Poppins? Or I'm like, you know, make a game out of turn it into a game. How do I gamify it? If I gotta get from A to B, what's blocking me? And how am I gonna move through it? And what's the story I can help myself create to get there? But, you know, depending on the mess you are in, you might use creativity differently. But I think creativity is valuable in all arenas. The other thing that like sometimes creativity is about keeping ourselves safe. And so, how does that lens help us do that? Is it by supporting us to leave a situation or advocate for ourselves in a different way, if we needed to, than the way that we were had been trying that wasn't working?

Carlene 35:05

Some some very, very, very like thoughtful words there, like some thoughtful

Where To Find Mari And Final Legacy

Carlene 35:10

advice, definitely. So if people want to work with you, Mari, you know, in a creative way.

SPEAKER_02 35:17

In a creative way. I love it. I am on all social media platforms at sustaining creativity. That is the best way, place to find me. I'm super active on Instagram, and then my podcast, Sustaining Creativity Podcast, you can find wherever you listen to podcasts. New episodes come out Tuesdays and hopefully Tuesdays and Fridays soon. There's over 300 episodes you can go back and listen to. I interview people from around the world on creativity, and it's a great time. I have learned so much, and I know you will too when you listen to whatever episode you tune into. So, yep, sustaining creativity is where you can find me the easiest. And yeah, shoot me a message, like a post, comment, I will respond because it's only me.

Carlene 36:07

Doing the things. Wow, that's amazing. Yeah. I think I have one more thing to ask. I I started asking this, and and what is the legacy that you want to leave behind?

SPEAKER_02 36:20

That creativity is for everyone, and your life can change with creativity.

Carlene 36:24

Somebody thought about those things. Wow.

SPEAKER_02 36:27

I like it, I like it.

Carlene 36:28

Say it again, say it again.

SPEAKER_02 36:30

Creativity is for everyone, and your life can change with creativity.

Carlene 36:33

I love it. That's amazing. So I want to thank you, Mari, for being on the show. I'm Carlene, and this is Diva Tonight with Mari Riesberg. And if you want to listen to her show, it's sustaining creativity, and maybe you'll learn a few things.

SPEAKER_00 36:50

Thanks for listening to Diva Tonight. Follow us on Instagram at DivaOnTheRadio. That's Diva with two eyes. And don't forget to follow us on TikTok at Diva on the radio. For more clips and conversations you'll love. Want to share your thoughts or send us a message? Text us anytime at divatonight.budsprout.com. Until next time, stay fabulous.